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#983354 - 01/08/18 08:47 PM DISASTROUS conference call....
eyeFISH Offline
Ornamental Rice Bowl

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 12766
Things are NOT swinging well for the conservation of the resource (Willapa) nor the rec contingent regarding the PS chinook plan and WB.

Have a listen...

https://wdfw.wa.gov/commission/meetings/2018/01/audio/20180105_d.mp3

WDFW and the Director has placed their "boss" in an unnecessary reactive frenzy of activity by hiding the facts of BOTH issues from the Commission.
_________________________
"Let every angler who loves to fish think what it would mean to him to find the fish were gone." (Zane Grey)

"If you don't kill them, they will spawn." (Carcassman)


The Keen Eye MD
Long Live the Kings!

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#983362 - 01/08/18 11:07 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1075
Loc: Graham, WA
Amazing how much chaos the Senior Leadership at WDFW has caused. If this was a regular corporation freaking heads would role!

Thanks eyeFish for taking the time to post this. The one light in all that darkness is the Commissioners are at least voicing more concern to insure things are as transparent as possible.
_________________________
"Forgiveness is between them and God. My job is to arrange the meeting."

1Sgt U.S. Army (Ret)

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#983365 - 01/09/18 08:06 AM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
WDFW X 1 = 0 Offline
My Area code makes me cooler than you

Registered: 01/27/15
Posts: 4549
WDFW leadership is now raping us all!!!

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#983369 - 01/09/18 09:41 AM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Salmo g. Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 13520
Being a Commissioner shouldn't be that hard or that much work. It's a volunteer position. Seems to me that misfeasance on the part of the Department is creating more work for the Commissioners.

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#983372 - 01/09/18 10:35 AM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Great Bender Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 01/03/17
Posts: 155
Loc: Hood Canal
If misfeasance on the part of the Department includes deliberately and intentionally pulling the wool over the eyes of the Commission--your correct. There's a great deal of smoke and mirrors being employed in that chamber, and any familiarity with the stance and priorities of the cast of characters involved will reveal a vivid picture of what's taking place. Little wonder WDFW falls back on Tribal sensitivity and Federal regulation to cloak their true intentions.

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#983373 - 01/09/18 11:05 AM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: Salmo g.]
Jake Dogfish Offline
Spawner

Registered: 06/24/00
Posts: 554
Loc: Des Moines
Originally Posted By: Salmo g.
Being a Commissioner shouldn't be that hard or that much work. It's a volunteer position. Seems to me that misfeasance on the part of the Department is creating more work for the Commissioners.

Work 2-3 days a month $100 dollars a day +expenses. Sign me up.

The call spent almost a hour discussing when to have the next hour long meeting... not sure why I needed to hear it.

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#983380 - 01/09/18 01:28 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Carcassman Online   content
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7410
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
If you are going to do a good job as a Commissioner there is a lot of background material to read, there are subcommittee meetings, and there are probably meetings with stakeholders if for no other reason than to gather information. There is a lot more to it than simply showing up a meeting and trusting staff.

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#983381 - 01/09/18 01:40 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: Jake Dogfish]
Larry B Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
Originally Posted By: Jake Dogfish
Originally Posted By: Salmo g.
Being a Commissioner shouldn't be that hard or that much work. It's a volunteer position. Seems to me that misfeasance on the part of the Department is creating more work for the Commissioners.


Work 2-3 days a month $100 dollars a day +expenses. Sign me up.

The call spent almost a hour discussing when to have the next hour long meeting... not sure why I needed to hear it.


Jake, if all of the time that a Commissioner dedicates is 2-3 days a month (that is, attending meetings) that $100 would still not be anywhere near enough.

My expectation is that Commissioners actually spend time preparing themselves on issues coming before them.

My perception is that they are not spending adequate prep time to ferret out the rampant misfeasance and occasional malfeasance (overwhelmed or disinterested???).

I recall former Commissioner Wecker opining to Rich Childers that all must be good in the crabbing world because she was not receiving complaints. Well, the Commission is certainly getting complaints now and has as a body the responsibility and authority to get those problems under control.

Edit: CM beat me to making that point as I typed.



Edited by Larry B (01/09/18 01:42 PM)
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!

It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)

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#983383 - 01/09/18 02:15 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Jake Dogfish Offline
Spawner

Registered: 06/24/00
Posts: 554
Loc: Des Moines
We certainly don’t need to pay them more for what people would do for free!
It’s already way to political and ridiculous 6 year terms.

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#983387 - 01/09/18 02:41 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Salmo g. Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 13520
Jake,

Most of us wouldn't work as cheap as you might. I've attended a lot of Commission meetings and seen the 2-3" thick binders of subject material they get every month to review. I doubt very many would do that job for free, let alone what they actually get once they discover just how much time is involved.

Sg

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#983388 - 01/09/18 02:49 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Jake Dogfish Offline
Spawner

Registered: 06/24/00
Posts: 554
Loc: Des Moines
Well that’s good, because I would not want anyone on the commission that is for driving Puget Sound Steelhead into extinction.
Or any of those that don’t understand they are contributing to there demise.

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#983389 - 01/09/18 03:30 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Carcassman Online   content
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7410
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
I have worked closely with a few Commissioners and, while they might not be the "norm" they put in way more time; they were probably paid about a dollar and hour.

It's a problem with many of those who (at least used to) work in natural resources. They put in tons of uncompensated time, whether it be reading, in the field, whatever. If you really care you put in the time.

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#983390 - 01/09/18 04:04 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: Jake Dogfish]
Larry B Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
Originally Posted By: Jake Dogfish
We certainly don’t need to pay them more for what people would do for free!
It’s already way to political and ridiculous 6 year terms.


I'd be willing to bet that most of the Commissioners would forego that $100 as it really constitutes a token payment for their services.

FYI the length of appointments is to allow for a more "gentle" turnover of Commissioners and a much higher continuity (retention of corporate knowledge) than if they were all to be, say, 2 year terms.

And if you think it is too political at the Commission level you obviously are too young to have been exposed to the prior knee jerk legislative mismanagement scheme.
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!

It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)

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#983392 - 01/09/18 04:54 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
_WW_ Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 01/30/13
Posts: 233
Loc: Skagit
When it was first announced that there would be a commission formed I thought it was a great idea. After being in many meetings over the last five years it's become increasingly clear that, as I told them, they are our only advocates in the department. Undermining them, is undermining us.
_________________________
Catch & Release Is Not A Crime

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#983395 - 01/09/18 05:47 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: _WW_]
Larry B Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/22/09
Posts: 3020
Loc: University Place and Whidbey I...
Originally Posted By: _WW_
When it was first announced that there would be a commission formed I thought it was a great idea. After being in many meetings over the last five years it's become increasingly clear that, as I told them, they are our only advocates in the department. Undermining them, is undermining us.


And that is exactly why complaining to Legislators about the Commission will only encourage further power plays to reduce the Commission to an advisory roll or eliminate it all together - with essentially the same negative effect.

Again, the Commission needs to exert its authority and fix the problem!
_________________________
Remember to immediately record your catch or you may become the catch!

It's the person who has done nothing who is sure nothing can be done. (Ewing)

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#983408 - 01/09/18 09:14 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Great Bender Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 01/03/17
Posts: 155
Loc: Hood Canal
Your e-mails and correspondence have been well heard by the Commissioners, as evidenced by EyeFish's audio link info at the start of this thread, as well as other sources. They are keenly aware the Director and Managers have not only led them astray, but kept them in the dark re: the pending Puget Sound Chinook Management Plan.
They invite further communication on your part, so as to make the difficult decision(s) that lie ahead truly reflective of your will.
The Ten Year Plan is fraught with hasty and ill-advised conclusions that can be modified if you support that action. PLEASE spread the word, and continue to promote and add to their support via their e-mail link at: https://wdfw.wa.gov.commission/contact.html. It's a relative quick process to fill out a short field and carry your message forward...


Edited by Great Bender (01/09/18 09:16 PM)
Edit Reason: diction

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#983409 - 01/09/18 10:08 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1075
Loc: Graham, WA
Contact the Commission

Appears the link in Great Bender's post above is broken. Here is a working link to gat a message to the Commission.

Vital that we let the Commission know we fully support them in rescinding or repairing the flawed RMP!


Edited by Bay wolf (01/09/18 10:09 PM)
_________________________
"Forgiveness is between them and God. My job is to arrange the meeting."

1Sgt U.S. Army (Ret)

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#983411 - 01/09/18 10:35 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: Bay wolf]
paguy Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 04/15/11
Posts: 116
Done.

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#983412 - 01/09/18 11:57 PM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: Larry B]
Jake Dogfish Offline
Spawner

Registered: 06/24/00
Posts: 554
Loc: Des Moines
Originally Posted By: Larry B
Originally Posted By: Jake Dogfish
We certainly don’t need to pay them more for what people would do for free!
It’s already way to political and ridiculous 6 year terms.


I'd be willing to bet that most of the Commissioners would forego that $100 as it really constitutes a token payment for their services.

FYI the length of appointments is to allow for a more "gentle" turnover of Commissioners and a much higher continuity (retention of corporate knowledge) than if they were all to be, say, 2 year terms.

And if you think it is too political at the Commission level you obviously are too young to have been exposed to the prior knee jerk legislative mismanagement scheme.

Who do we hold accountable?
Too knee jerk?? What are they accomplishing now? What are they even capable of doing?

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#983418 - 01/10/18 07:03 AM Re: DISASTROUS conference call.... [Re: eyeFISH]
Carcassman Online   content
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7410
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
Two levels of accountability. The Commission has to explain, clearly and publicly, why they retain the Director (who I think is their only hire/fire) when the Agency goes against policy, does not follow direction and so on.

The second is to go to the Governor and demand new Commissioners if they won't control WDFW.

The problem is that it is rather obvious that the Governor, Leg, and Agency are traveling in one direction and the Agency in other. If that is the case, then the only solution I see to gaining public stakeholder control is an Initiative that directly elects Commissioners (may then need to pay them. etc.). The risk there is that the hook and bullet crowd is smaller than the huggers of warm and fuzzies......

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