Ok I well keep the snob references out.

I dont know Commissionor Von Geek but I also relised that the guy who wrote the atricle for wash H+F news got that vibe from him or her wouldnt put it in the atricle. So Thats My Assumption yes I take full responsibility for it...Im actually hoping lots of people question him for his actions Hes scheduled for part 2 of the interview I would like to hear his thoughts.

Now back to the topic I like the way todd writes I had to agree with the list he put togather. and please remember Im not a Neanderthal Im Neanderthal like it takes along time to put my thought into words so sometimes that are a little sharp around the edges. Ask any one that know me and they well tell you I love to fish. I keep a log and Ive had 108 entrys of successful trips starting the 24 of jan 03 I do not log trips where I dont catch fish so how many times do I fish im not sure ...I travel alot and fish lots of differt styles and have caught every thing from bass to wahoo...the only two fish that I want to catch and havent yet is a over 100 pound butt and a rooster fish from the warm waters to our south.

Homer thought everyone had a problem with crackers I do not there are former crackers on this board I well not list them but they fish with me all the time but lurk in the shadows with out posting HINT HINT. With a little bit of help these crackers have become great fishermen.

I also believe that no one should have more then 6 fish in there freezer at one time. Now I dont go out a try to pass laws making sure that everyone only has 6 fish, and sometimes I cant keep the smoker going fast enough I get more then 6. But I do try to maintain 6 and I when at all possible I try to instill that into the guys who fish with me (when the timing is right theres nothing worse then some one pushing there style on you when the timing is not right) I seen the topic not to long ago some to the line of "your walking out with a 24 pound king and some guys backs out of the river and says you realy should use a orange corkie" and your the one holding the fish....go figure....so back in track

So heres my point (I know I drove along way to get here) I dont really have a problem with fly fishing ony waters, or how you fish as long as its ethical I hate snaggers..Now dont get me wrong fly only waters are wrong but to me thats small potatoes. But you have to admit there are some people who just want every thing there way. WCR is wrong not because I dont want to save steelhead, its because someone in seattle (that no one realy knows his agenda) is now telling people who have managed good returns that they now have to start releasing there results. its just wrong...I do catch and release LOTS of fish. I have no problem with rivers that have low returns being C+R barbless hooks only. its just when someone one without knowing their agenda comes across and trys to change things that dont need to be change you must stand up and take note. thats they way things get taken away...


heres my mental picture:

a group of guys appointed to take care of the wildlife are reviewing submitted public input on how to protect our wildlife. Out of the blue one says lets just ban forever the keeping of wild fish. another points out there well be people up in arms if you do that. so out of the blue the same one says lets do it for 6 years. the others say your going to cause trouble, so a different one says lets do it for 2 years and see if we can ride out the uproar....the guy who wants it baned forever thinks to himself. In 2 years if were are still appointed to this position I well bring up the fact that its been 2 years and now the uproar has died down and no one now seems to care, we should ban it forever....Now let me ask you is this the way you want your laws made...no science, no public input, just someone with an unknown agenda apointed by the worst govener for wildlife to ever sit at the capital building and this guy describes him self as an avid fly fishermen ...answer that....

as to an item posted on this topic...Sparky I do relise that steelheaders use heavy leaders. but the drag from the heavy diameter line along with the softer rods (that restrict how much muscle you can put on the fish) do exhaust fish faster and further then gear rods.

Hey now........you tell Bill to mellow out a little.

Boy Mr vedder as soon as I think you a fence sitter you come out and make sence...

.I argee that snaggers could make the same argument but Im assuming that a majority of the board are ethical fishermen and the snaggers are over on the trailer parks pursuits board. ok im trying to hard to be funny...

That comment is a little ironic coming from someone who was so very proud of landing a large native steelhead on 'trout gear.'

Again, steelheaders dont use wispy rods. And the drag of the flyline makes little differance...like I said it takes me just as long to land a steelhead with a #9 Spey rod that it does with terminal tackle...and it takes just as long to land a steelhead with my #7 single-hander as it does terminal tackle.

Deja Vu

Talk to the hand, cause the ears aint listening.

The trout gear fish was very cool. we were fishing for trout and the steelhead took the little tiny egg that was on the line. total supprise and was very cool. the fish was caught it a river that has both wild and hatchery fish and hatchery fish can be keept there. on 6 pound test the fish ran far and we realy couldnt tell if it had a fin or not. the fish was hooked in the hole just below the 99 bridge on the samish river and ran to the 4th house on the left of the river thats his lawn where the fish is beached. its only about 100 yards oh yea I totally lied about the 1/4 mile stuff and where we we Im not saying that Im not above lying to the main board to keep the places I fish a little less crowded. there have been a few people that privately email me and Im always open for questions. I give away good fishng spots all the time and do show alot of things just like an open book....so go ahead and judge My friend who caught the fish and myself for not makeing him break it off.
which I may or maynot have done myself...this is the point I have been trying to make...IT WAS HIS CHOISE TO LAND THE FISH NOT YOURS NOT MINE...it still is he can land the fish and take his lure out...why would you guys want to give up your choices.....PS Im sure that fish lived...I dont have evidence but Im telling you may I never catch another fish that it didnt dye...judge away....DJ

Todd pretty much sumed it up for me. There are very few waters that I enjoy fishing more than areas like Dry Falls, Rocky Ford Creek etc..

Now if commissoner Van Geekenbeck was to propose a statewide flyfishing only rule. I wouldn't like that very much and I'm worried that the recent statewide WSR ruling looks too much like that to me.

PS Sparky I realy dont hate you I realy dont hate anyone.....its all this lets tell everyone else how to fish stuff...I think I have good ethics and pride myself in teaching what I know (fishing) ...its the thought of you know whats best for all of us BS
and again I question every bodys logic when it comes to changing things that arent broke....please reread the mental pic I posted above...I have no proof on how it went down but in my life I have seen things go away but stuff that starts just like this....the fly rod stuff is just to give you something to think about what If I submit a bill to not let you fly fish for steelhead (with the above reasons) and it somehow makes it bye mr Von G then I even tongue in cheek gloat about it on this board.
what are we to think about you...think about it
ask around for people who know me they well tell you Im not about being Neanderthal...DJ

DJ: I sincerely appreciate your evenhanded and analysis and the fact that you can argue without insults and name calling unlike some on this board.

I do not think that there is much chance of a proliferation of fly-fishing only waters in this state. When I look at the list above I see few if any recent additions. This like so many of our threads relate to the fact that we have all lost so many opportunities in the last couple of decades that it's understandable why anyone would cringe at any further lost opportunity. I think that overall we all share the goal of more opportunity and more fish. While I freely admit that there are plenty of non-fly fishers who work hard for the resource, guys like Grandpa, there are also many fly-fishing organizations that also work hard for more opportunity. Too bad we have such a hard time cooperating on things like getting rid of gillnets, clear cuts, pollution, draining of swamplands etc. etc. etc.

Dave-

I think your summed it up nicely.... People are tired of lost opportunity. Its like taxes, people are sick of taxes so even school levies are failing at an alarming rate.... (Sequim might lose all sports, art, etc... in May) Eyemans initatives prove this as well, harmful in the long run, but short term relief.

You hit the nail on the head.

I have said before it was to bad sparky didnt see a netter pull a chum out of a net and strip her eggs and toss her back....I would buy him lunch if he chased that agenda. But to pick the smallest pesentage of fish kill and make every do it the same why he does is wrong. My release tactics werent much different execpt I would take a pic I well stand by my live release stats if it were possible to keep them. I still feel that light line (Rob was guily and I was with him so I am too) / and fly rods do as much damage as bad releases but. Education is the answer not more laws.

but heres the new question pointed out by bruce what if now commissoner Van Geekenbeck was to propose a statewide flyfishing only rule.

the numbers of fish would increase because the reduction of fishermen. The netters would still get there fish. the state would pat them selves on the back saying what a great job they did on bringing back the fish.

Ok here is were I'm going to try to sell you something!

Go and read David R. Montgomery book
"King of Fish the Thousand-Year Run of Salmon"

And learn about the 5-H's

Thank you homer. I well...DJ


And PS

one of my co workers (a non fishermen)pointed out that sparkys fight ,resolve and ambition to stand up to what he thinks is right, reminds him of my passion and love of fishing. (gave me something to think about) So even though we disagree (you big fly weenie) dont change a bit the sport grows on passion.

I can go fit in at places like Minter Cr. and other shoulder to shoulder places and fly fish. I just use a roll cast and take up as much room as the other guy.

What a lot of fly fishermen don't like is the heavy lead being cast at fish that in many placed will spook them, while a fly can be cast with very little detection by the fish and won't spook them.

That is sometimes known as the "Dark Side" of fly fishing. Sometimes I will do that, but traditional fly fishing (and one that works often better than even gear fishing) for steelhead is swinging flies ising sinkinf lines not "nymphing" as that is called.

I often find that fly fishermen are more friendly to talk to and will tell you what is working and how to catch the fish. Fly fishermen I've also noticed are more friendly to the enviroment (little or no garbage in fly fishing only waters). Fly fishermen are also seem to use the fishing ethics i.e. no stepping in below a person fishing a run.

Now gear fishermen (not all but many) leave garbage, have little respect for other angler and are other secretive. Keep in mind that this is not all gear fishermen.

I'm a little confused

Are you saying that people who live in trailer parks are unethical or unethical people only live in trailer parks?
And either way what does that have to do with the subject?



herm

LOL, I think what he means is that it seems most of the coined "redneck white trash snaggers" you see on the rivers are either uneducated, poor, or both. LOL. Just tying in an image. Is it correct? Not all the time. But I can personally attest to one snagfest on a local Gig Harbor Chum Creek where I knew most of the snaggers (delivered to all of them, or knew them from talking to them on the route) and most fit that bill to a T. Is that correct for everyone? Nah. But just one of those "stereotypes" people use.

Sheesh, some people read a bit too far into some of these posts. Hell, I guess I'm one sometimes. LOL

By Bruce
"Now if commissoner Van Geekenbeck was to propose a statewide flyfishing only rule. I wouldn't like that very much and I'm worried that the recent statewide WSR ruling looks too much like that to me."

By DJS
"but heres the new question pointed out by bruce what if now commissoner Van Geekenbeck was to propose a statewide flyfishing only rule."
Man, do you know how absurd you guys sound. Your really grasping at straws. What if one of the commercial guys proposed you can only fish with a net?

It was only an anology showing how small things grow big. Are you so blind that you dont think people have agendas. I know there are poeple out there that would love to see somthing like that maybe not such a grand scale but......


and the trailer park thing was just a point... others got it..Mr Vedder pointed out that the snaggers must have been p***ed when they had to stop.......let me start in on the imigrants that dont understand english when the game wardon shows up at the "wall of shame on whatcom creek"....I never fish there but stop by to watch the cops swoop in on bikes and hand out citations....its just like the TV show...DJ